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IT'S SAD TO SAY BUT MINISTER "GYPSY" PETERS WAS RIGHT!!!!

It saddens me to say this, after all the fight from both the local and international pan world, but after some results in the semi-final round of Panorama 2011, i cannot agree more. PANORAMA (JUDGING) IS KILLING PAN.

Firstly let me say that i didnt play with nor have afilliations with any particular band. I dont know, and i stand to be corrected, that there's any Judge in the Panorama competition that got a greater listening position, or has vastly greater academic or musical experience than many of the members or visitors of this WST website. I might go even further to compare them to the average visitor to the panyards.

To think that year after year, people expect and beg of Pan Trinbago to find the MOST Competent Panel of Judges, and i firmly believe this is one area that the organization unfortunately fails every single year.

In regards to the title of my discussion, after listening to every band LIVE and then seeing the results, there is no way the judges came even close to getting it right based on the CRITERIA. Even though the criteria itself is another topic for discussion, based on what we have to go by right now, something has gone terribly wrong with our judging system.

 

When 90% of listeners have commented on the poor tonal quality sound of a band like SILVER STARS, among other valid observations, how can they come out on top? It goes further into what growth can  be expected for pan by Panorama Competition??? NONE!! WHY?  When you have a competition that you cant expect to hear anything different from the previous years, and this is being rewarded with full marks, can we really ever expect growth??

 

I will leave it here for now and leave it up to the pan world to discuss. Let's wake up, be real, whether our band is on top or not, is this fair to the Artform???

 

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Our panorama is not what it used to be. I listened to the interview with Raff Robertson and Alvin Daniel, I wish they can run that interview again. The interpretation of an arrangement is not given any consideration. I don't agree that the bands that placed first really did us justice. The arranger for one of the bands constantly repeats himself and is rewarded with top honours almost all the time. the other band , very poor tonal quality and yet still at the top. What we the judges listening to? The south band had a better and more spirited interpretation of Benji's Trini, yet the town band placed higher. I love my culture and will support it always , but, too many glaring poor judging showing their head.
I THINK THIS IS THE BIGGEST DAGGER "too many glaring poor judging showing their head." Is not just that pan is about interpretation and we all are humans. we agree to that. Everyone one makes mistakes, but when it becomes GLARING.. PROBLEMS AFTER THAT!!

The "south band" with the "better and more spirited interpretation" also played significantly past the stipulated time. They ended at 8:24. Could it be that they were penalised for this?

THE STIPULATED TIME IS 8:00 Minutes.. WITH 30 SECS GRACE... In the rules...

 

but there;s a new criteria:

 

Judging of panorama (esp. Large bands) are based on the following:

 

1. Crowd response

 

2. Your NAME

 

3. ANTICS (Everything else but the arrangement) which they try to disguise under Performance

 

4. Previous Years issues (band get thief last year, we owe them this year)

 

5. Play whatever you play the year before ( we didnt hear it properly then)

 

 

 

Based on the above criteria the scores of the Semi-final are much more accurate!!

 

 

 

PANORAMA MAY NOT DIRECTLY BE KILLING PAN, BUT ITS AGENTS (PAN TRINBAGO & JUDGES ARE)

 

 

FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY!! ( i doh have court clothes. lol)

 

 

court clothes? Neither me! Interesting list of criteria! On way for us to discuss the results objectively would be for PanTrinbago to assign random numbers to the judges and publish  the criteria, weight and all of their scores and comments so we could all discuss whether "Judge #3" was justified in awarding x points to so and so band for tonal quality. Too much of our discussions are based on subjectivity in the absence of precise information 

 I SAY, even the bands can do soo.. For legal purposes block out the name of the judges and post their sheets.. But most of the top bands KNOW the sheets are as flimsy as their aarangements so they wont. I hate to be sounding soo sour but im tired our going to panorama and hearing the SAME thing over and over. AND I BLAME PAN TRINBAGO AND JUDGES FOR THIS. WHY??

 

The bands that do this getting constant reward for this.. So even the other bands who didnt use to do it starting to follow suit, at the expense of good music just at a shot of the TITLE or $$$

Problem is - each arranger has a particular style, which is why one could easily identify a Jit-, Boogsie-, Bradley-, Holman-, or Smooth-arrangement. As soon as their style becomes too successful it is branded as redundant. Does not happen as much in other genres of music. Check the jazz greats for example. They too are recognised for their unique style but seldom trashed for "the same thing every year". Could it be because they are not judged in competition every year?

Oh im sorry if what i said was mistaken for this... I dont mind hearing a bradley / Jit / Boogsie TYPE arrangement but any true listener would be able to note that Bradley arrangement of High Mas, and Rebecca or Boogsie's Music in we blood, and Sharing licks even though coming from the SAME ARRANGER had a different Feel, or can be classed as totally contrasting arrangements.

 

My issue is when there are clear distinctions in your music over consecutive years, GIVING the impression its either YOUR IDEAS LACKING or THE JUDGES EARS LACKING... Take your pick.

Good point. Well made. And taken with respect!

We tour the pan yards listening to bands night after night, and you are so correct about the two large bands that played I Is A Trini the first night that we went to deep South we knew that they had a better arrangement and sounded much better than the other. But since Hatters it was said that not another South band will ever win the  Panorama again. remember Fonclaire and Pan by Storm? I am nearly at the end of my life and that statement is coming to pass The people in South/Central seem to no longer care but take pleasure in which ever band is in the finals

. I totally agree with you  about the two top bands especially Silver Stars. But that does not give anyone the right to say that Gypsy is correct insaying that Panorama is killing Pan as that is not true if anything it cause open debate like this forum. All that is needed is someone in Pan Trinbago to listen.

Ah love it ah love it i would just like to say thank u in advance for joining the group at  http://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/group.php?gid=308949992352
I  grew up in pan, listening for the first half of my life then actually playing the next half.  I believe have a discerning ear, and I find Silver Stars to be too noisy.  I say this because when you watch the players, they are literally beating the pans into submission, with the premise that they are performing.  This causes a metallic sound.  They are 'untuning' the pans, causing that noisy sound. The arrangement is filled with repetitive three note runs, the baseline sounds like a doo doop at Intercol ( two notes for large portions of the song) another offender in this last respect is the great All Stars, and the arrangement has not changed for the past five years.  I can say this because my son played for Silver Stars three years ago and I'm still hearing some of the same passages.   Yet they are rewarded with high scores, including full marks for tonal quality.  This is a musical competition, and the bands that really play good music, and have great tonal quality, inovative interpretation and arrangements,  are left for dead.  I fully agree with the views of eighty percent of the submissions to this topic.  The Judges need to be truely unbiased, properly trained, have a good memory for what has been played in the past, and have perfect pitch.  They don't hear good at all!

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