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Comparing the RENEGADES and DESPERADOES versions of "YEAR FOR LOVE"

This is not my topic!!! I am just following the orders of Ms. Gillian Bishop as she wants a musical discussion integrated into the back and forth. Earlier today I made a call for KNOWLEDGEABLE MUSIC PEOPLE on the forum to come forward and discuss the 2018 Panorama Performances.

Ms. Bishop took the initiative and drew a musical comparison between Renegades and Desperadoes when she said that one band used the song to reflect the violence in the society and the other chose to represent the sweet voice of VOICE.

What are your thoughts and interpretations of the performances.

(Gillian: You just put me in a trap because merrytonestothebone and doctor delight just waiting for me to say the wrong thing about RENEGADES and they want to chop off my head. But that is OKAY!!! No rank!!! I just try to keep the forum going -- not just at PANORAMA.)

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No but I grew up under him playing with Chase Manhattan Savoys and we lived close to each other for all my younger years in lLaventille.

That arrangement of Panama was for me one of the best Panorama arrangements EVER!!

Sparrow’s “Statue” by Renegades was another fabulous arrangement. Jit was playing around with a call and response between the upper pans and lower pans which were playing the melody, full of texture. Some of us remember as part of their presentation, they brought an effigy onstage which fell over!!!

Skiffle was a bit ragged but very exciting. The young people in the North Stand went wild. Phase 2 were not so exciting but yes, the arrangement was more coherent and better executed 

I'm not a panist or a musician I just appreciate when a steel Orchestra plays good music. How I differentiate Bp Renegades to Desperadoes each of these two bands tend to use the different sections in different ways to bring out that special sound that when you hear either band play you can say to yourself  yes I heard this sound and that's how I compare the two bands. BP   Renegades played with a sweet warm pore raising effect to let you feel the Love that is missing in society, When I hear certain parts that they played it really bought tears to my eyes I felt so emotional and I said to myself why can't we just get along.... And then Desperadoes when I heard them I really didn't get that emotional. Now that's the difference I got from that same song.....

Very nice, Allison!!! Come back during the PANORAMA and give us summaries of all TEN BANDS. But, could you please tell me what you think about SKIFFLE and their version of HELLO!!!

Allison, your interpretation of the Renegades arrangement is interesting.

Allison, you said it all. At about six minutes into the song, the variation on the theme,  did bring water to my eyes and raise my pores. Despers did no such thing, hence the difference in standing. This I know, without a shadow of doubt , is Duvonne's first win in the large band category. 

Miss Gillian: You are one of the most intriguing PAN LOVERS that I have ever met. What I like about is you is your INTELLECTUAL BALANCE -- very uncommon among PAN LOVERS. A breath of FRESH AIR on the forum. Plenty people does run around talking about how much they KNOW ABOUT PAN. You JUST KNOW and you don't have to SCREAM out LOUD to the world THAT YOU KNOW. So I think that you did the FORUM a big favour by coming and sharing and I hope you stick around or drop in more from time to time.

I am not a BIG PUZZLE. I have spent years pouring time, money and energy into supporting PAN (still supporting, actually). And I have a VISION that some day somebody is going to record some decent pan music that could gain some worldwide airplay and sales and music reviews. Somehow, I have always believed that when I hear it I will recognize it.

I have always felt that with the 20,000 members on WST there should be more postings and progressive topics and contributions to THE MECCA (financial) -- so I try to keep the conversations going. It's that simple for me!!!

My two issues are PROPER ADMINISTRATION of PAN TRINBAGO and building a GLOBAL FAN BASE for the MUSIC -- because I do see the POTENTIAL!!!

Mr Claude Gonsalves, thank you. And to all over 18 years, I’m Gillian.  You have some interesting ideas about taking Pan forward......we must talk more

Gillian: Well, like yuh bless!!! Yuh first topic on the forum (that I know of at least) and you had over 800 views and some serious and knowledgeable PAN LOVERS exchanging technicalities with you.

If you want to know, over the last 40 years I must have attended over A THOUSAND PAN SHOWS across California -- as a supporter!!! But since I don't play, I got to observe the reactions of hundreds of thousands of people to the PAN. And, apart from my issues, I just had to respect the impact of the music on those audiences and the potential to make music specifically for those audiences. The good thing about you is that I don't have to give you a LONG SPEECH for you to get the picture.

The regret is that the people who were playing the music were so focused on the paycheck at the end of the show they could never see THE BIGGER PICTURE. (That is why I have the utmost respect for Emile Straker -- but that is another story.) Not only that, the EXPAT MARKET is a BIG MARKET that could be tapped. I am also a BIG ADVOCATE of EXPATS and LOCALS working together for the benefit of the PAN MUSIC. But I think that I will be long gone before eyes get opened and petty grievances dissolve to empower a unified effort. I know that it is hard to bridge the GAP -- but people should be trying.

I will give you a good joke. When I first came on this forum I stated one day that I am NOT EMOTIONALLY ATTACHED to PAN MUSIC -- well yuh never see one man GET CUSS OUT SO in your life. But, again, I do see the potential and it is just matter of time before those students coming out of the 800 PLUS school programs across AMERICA start making music with the PAN that appeals to WIDER AUDIENCES.

I ain't NATIONALISTIC, but I would like to see  A TRINIDADIAN out there in the world with the social and diplomatic and communication and musical and educational skills necessary to deliver the PAN MUSIC PRODUCT. (It goes beyond being able to play the PAN because most of the foreigners I have seen react to PAN MUSIC cannot tell the difference between a good player and a marginal one.) Actually, I am a little surprised and disappointed that NEW YORK has NOT PRODUCED that performer. But I understand the mental limitations.

Now you know what's on my mind!!!

Sorry I took so long to weigh in. Three things I’m reluctant to discuss in open forum: politics, religion and Pan. It is the Fans, (NOT THE MUSICIANS) who are too emotionally involved to be even civil when there is disagreement. And that is perhaps why the progress that pan should be making internationally is slow. Too much bickering and fighting and tribalism among the supporters. This year some new things are happening

1. Among the big and powerful bands, all went with party songs.

2. More than ever Gen X-ers dominating the bands’ populations

3. Larger than ever audience of young people. 

The party songs do not have a normal verse and chorus structure and so there is some space to explore in different ways the source material. (If you ever try to arrange a Dr Foster song, you have no room to grow). The party songs are well known to everybody and so audience and players alike feel that they KNOW the song. So all in all, things are different........Different Me by Despers and Hold dem by  All Stars and their Panorama victories were enough to send all the Bands scrambling for the party songs. My personal preference since Starlift 1972 is for the own tune (watch me duck here) so I don’t have a dog in this fight.......just saying

Personally I don't think any rendition reflected violence, to me what you heard were ...should I say .. a classical trained arranger's version as opposed to a student of jazz's version. Renegades encapsulated all the basic elements found in romantic classical music. Not taking anything away from Desperadoes but their version sounded great, however too jazzy which we all know is Zanda's forte. Great versions any way you look at it.


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